有责任意识的投资者如何掀起浪潮，令公司做出改变 – Vinay Shandal

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有责任意识的投资者如何掀起浪潮，令公司做出改变 - Vinay Shandal

在一个既紧急又有趣的演讲中，咨询人士维纳 · 山达尔分享了世界顶级激进投资者的故事，向人们展示了私人和机构如何在自己的轨道(剧本)上通过向企业施压来制造正向变革。“你有权利来让自己的钱以一种和你的价值观相符的方式被管理起来，”山达尔说到。“使用你的呼声，并且相信这些呼声可以产生作用。”

00:01
We love to engage on the issues of the day. We love it. We comment on the news, we post our views on social media, we march, we protest ... But who among us is working on solutions, big solutions to big issues, like gun violence, mistreatment of workers, flood, famine, drought? Who is on it? Boom! These guys.
我们热衷于讨论当今的问题，我们喜欢这样。我们评论新闻，在社交媒体上发表自己的观点，我们示威，抗议，但是我们当中有谁在解决问题，为重大问题提供大型解决方案，比如枪支暴力，员工不公平待遇，洪灾，饥荒，干旱？谁在忙于这些？看看吧！是这些人。

00:32
What? You were hoping for Peter Parker? The Avengers? You don't expect this beacon of diversity, these good-looking, nicely dressed dudes just oozing charisma to solve the issues? Well good, because they're actually not going to solve the issues. But before you dismiss them, let me say, they're not going to solve the issues, but they will show us how. So who are they? They're activist investors: Carl Icahn, Dan Loeb, Paul Singer, Barry Rosenstein. These are the modern-day OGs of Wall Street.
什么？你们希望是彼得 · 帕克（蜘蛛侠）？还是复仇者联盟？你们不期望是这些具备多样性的标杆人物，这些相貌堂堂，穿着光鲜，散发着魅力的人去解决问题？那就对了，因为他们也不是来解决问题的。但是，在你们解雇他们之前，我想说，他们不会去解决问题，但是他们将向我们展示该如何解决问题。那么他们是谁？他们是激进投资者。卡尔 · 伊坎，丹 · 罗伯，保罗 · 辛格，巴里 · 罗森斯坦。他们是当下华尔街的大佬。

01:10
(Laughter) These are scary dudes.
这些都是可怕的家伙。

01:12
I don't mean Green Goblin scary. I mean real scary. The fear they strike in the hearts of a company's CEO and board when they enter its stock is the same fear you feel when you hear a bear outside your tent, and it's dark, and you're sitting there with a mouthful of Doritos --
我不是说像绿恶魔那种可怕，我是说真正的可怕。是当他们进入到一个公司的股票行业后，那种会打击一个公司CEO和董事会内心的可怕，和你在夜晚的帐篷中听到外面有熊的那种恐惧感如出一辙，你正坐在帐篷中，嘴里塞满了多力多滋玉米片——

01:33
that just moments ago, you had snuck out of the tent to pull down from the bear hang, because you had the munchies. That fear. And in that moment, you are praying, "Oh Lord, please let this bear be passing through." That bear is not passing through! That bear made a detour for you. Bears like Doritos!
也就是不久前你刚潜出帐篷从熊挂的地方取下来的那包，因为你想吃点心了。就是那种恐惧。在那一刻，你祈祷着， “噢，上帝，请让这只熊赶紧离开吧！” 这只熊不会走开！那只熊绕道走向了你，熊喜欢吃玉米片！

01:55
Activists like money. Some activists also like Doritos, but they definitely want money. And the way they make money, the way they create value, is by getting management of corporations to make changes.
激进投资者喜欢钱。一些投资者也喜欢玉米片，但是他们绝对更想要钱。并且他们赚钱的方式，他们创造价值的方式，是通过企业的管理去制造改变。

02:14
Now, some will argue that the changes they create, the value they create, is too short-term in nature. And others will say the tactics they use are egregious. I agree. Long, drawn-out lawsuits, public smear campaigns -- there is no need for that. But I must say, there's a small handful of activists, very small, that go to great lengths to be constructive and collaborative. And overall, we have to give credit where credit is due. As a group, they have managed to catalyze large-scale change in large corporations, and that's no small feat.
有些人会争辩，认为他们创造的这种改变，他们创造的价值，在自然中周期太短。其他人则认为他们使用的策略太过分。我同意。长期，持久的诉讼，公然的恶意营销—— 是没有必要的。但是我必须说，有少数的投资者非常之少，他们付诸很大努力来保持建设性和协作性。总体上来说，我们需要在需要信任的地方给予信任。作为一个团体，他们设法在大公司中制造了大规模的变革，这可不是什么不起眼的成就。

02:50
Now, imagine a world where all investors were working with management to make change, not just to make more money, but to improve the environment and society. Imagine what a greener and better world this would be. Now, why? Why would an investor bother? And at first, blush I'm with you: Why would an investor care? Because if doing well on ESG issues -- environmental, social and governance issues -- was just an act of good corporate citizenship, then I agree, investors would not care. But the good news, and perhaps the saving grace for our collective futures, is that it's so much more than an act of good corporate citizenship. It's good business. There's now enough evidence that shows a clear correlation between ESG performance and financial performance. Companies that do good for the environment and society also do well financially. And some of the best companies are catching on.
现在设想一下，在一个社会中，所有的投资者都在通过管理来创造改变，不只是赚取更多的钱，而是为了改善环境和社会。想象一下，那将是一个多么环保并且美好的世界。然而，为什么投资者会不厌其烦的这么做？首先，我跟你们一样纳闷儿：为什么投资者会在意这件事儿？因为如果在 ESG 的问题上—— 即环境问题，社会问题和管理问题上——表现很好，这只是一个好的企业公民的行为，那么我同意，投资者不会在意。但是好的消息，或者说我们共同未来的救赎，远比一个好的企业的公民行为具有更深远的意义，那就是好的业务。有很多证据可以证明好的财务表现和ESG的表现之间存在明显的关联。那些在环境和社会问题上做的很好的企业，通常在财务上也表现的很好。一些最好的公司也在迎头赶上。

03:47
Like Adidas: Adidas is cleaning up the ocean and making money in the process. Adidas teamed up with an organization called Parley for the Oceans. Parley goes out and collects plastic waste from the ocean. Adidas uses the plastic waste to make shoes. Shoes made with plastic from the ocean: good for the environment and good for business. Because if you know that rapidly growing consumer segment known as hipsters -- and I know you know hipsters -- then you know that a hipster faced with the choice between a no-name shoe and an Adidas made with plastic from the ocean will pick the Adidas every day of the week and twice on Sunday, and then walk around like it's no big deal but look for every opportunity to talk about them. Like, in an Uber Pool.
比如阿迪达斯：阿迪达斯正在清洁海洋，同时也在这个过程中赚钱。阿迪达斯成立了一个组织叫做 “海洋会谈”。这个组织致力于搜集海洋中的塑料垃圾。阿迪达斯利用这些塑料垃圾制造鞋子。从海洋中获取的塑料垃圾制作的鞋子：对环境和业务都有好处。因为如果你知道有一群迅速增长的消费者群体叫做时尚族的话—— 我知道你们都了解时尚族—— 你就知道当一个时尚族在一个无名品牌的鞋子和一个阿迪达斯生产的用海洋塑料垃圾制作的鞋子之间做选择时，他一周中每天都会挑选一次阿迪达斯，周末会挑选两次，然后出去转转，表现得没什么特别，但是却会见缝插针的找机会跟人讨论关于鞋子的话题，比如跟人共享打车的时候。

04:34
"Hey, I noticed you looking at my feet."
“嘿，我注意到你在看我的脚。”

04:37
"What? Dude, no, I'm just making slides. I'm a consultant. I make slides. I'm making PowerPoint slides, I'm not looking --"
“什么？老兄，不，我只是在做幻灯片，我是一个咨询顾问，我在做幻灯片。我在做 ppt 幻灯片，我没有看——”

04:43
"No, it's fine. I get why you'd be looking. The plastic on my shoe must be bothering you. Well, let me talk about it for the rest of this ride. You see, the plastic on my shoe is from the ocean, on my feet, not in your fish, being walked on, not being munched on. Happy feet. Happy fish. Happy ocean. Doing my part. I got eco-shoes. I got eco-shoes. You need some eco-shoes?"
“噢不，没关系的。我知道你们为什么一直在看了。我鞋上的塑料一定让你觉得奇怪。好的，在我们下车前可以讨论一下这个话题。实际上我鞋上的塑料来自海洋，在我的脚上，并不在你吃的鱼的肚子里，在脚上穿着走，没有被吃进嘴里。幸福双脚，幸福鱼类，幸福海洋。保护海洋人人有责，我买了双环保鞋。你也来几双怎么样？”

05:04
And so on, just cornering him. We've all been there.
诸如此类，别太当真。我们都有过这样的时刻。

05:07
"Hey, pass me your cell phone. I'll give you a discount code. Let me give you a discount code."
“把手机给我，给您一个折扣码吧。让我给您一个折扣码。”

05:11
We've all been -- Folks, I have jumped out of moving Uber Pools.
我们曾经都—— 伙计们，这会儿我已经跳下车了。

05:16
Just, moving, highway, I'm out. I'm out.
（笑）就是在高速公路上飞驰的时候，我忍不住坚持要下车。

05:20
But we've got to forgive the hipsters, we need to love the hipsters. We need hipsters, and we need companies like Adidas, and what we need most is for investors to convince other companies to behave like Adidas.
但是我们需要原谅时尚潮人，我们需要爱护这些时尚族。我们需要潮人，也需要像阿迪达斯这样的企业，我们最需要的是让投资者说服其他公司向阿迪达斯学习。

05:31
And herein lies the challenge. There's a growing group of investors, call them "conscious investors." Conscious investors care about ESG issues. And they talk a lot about engaging management on ESG issues. But they don't actually get management to make changes that will improve the environment and society. And this is where conscious investors can take a page from the playbook of the activist investors, because the activist investors have no issues getting management to make changes. They have no issues turning up the heat.
这就是挑战所在。有这么一群数量不断增长的投资者，我们称之为 “有意识的投资者”。有意识的投资者关注ESG问题。他们讨论许多关于参与到 ESG问题管理的话题。但是他们并不会实际参与到这些管理工作中来，这些工作将来会改善环境和社会状况。这就是有责任意识的投资者可以从激进投资者的剧本中学习的一页，因为激进投资者在管理层做出改变方面没有任何问题。他们在搞事情方面也没有任何问题。

06:04
Take Paul Singer. He's an old-school Wall Street OG, now in his 70s, loves Doritos, loves making money. Argentina owed Paul 600 million dollars and would not pay. Big mistake. You can't take money from an OG and not pay it back. Paul went to war with Argentina. I am not inventing. This is big. This was huge. This was bigger than Tyson vs Holyfield, Ali vs Foreman. This was man vs country. Paul Singer started going around the world trying to seize up Argentinian assets. At one point, he tried to seize an Argentinian navy vessel off the coast of Ghana. He tried to take over a 350-foot ship while big navy officers with big guns were on the ship. He got the police in Ghana to show up with a crane and threaten to board the ship, and it wasn't until the navy officers drew their weapons that they called off the operation. That's what I call turning up the heat.
以保罗 · 辛格尔为例。他是一位华尔街的老家伙，已经70多岁了，喜欢玉米片，喜欢赚钱。阿根廷欠保罗6亿美金并且想赖账。真是大错特错了。你不可能从一个老家伙那里拿钱而不还回去。保罗于是和阿根廷开战了。我并没有胡说八道。这确实是一个巨大的错误，比泰森和霍利菲尔德的，比阿里和福尔曼的问题还严重。这是一个人和一个国家的矛盾。保罗 · 辛格尔周游世界，尝试去没收阿根廷在各处的资产。曾经有一次，他尝试在加纳海岸没收一艘阿根廷的海军潜艇。他尝试去拿走一艘350英尺的船，而在那艘船上有全副武装的海军军官。他雇佣加纳的警察调来一台起重机并威胁要登船，直到海军军官亮出了武器，他们才罢休。这就是我所说的 “搞事情”。

07:08
Now, you may say Paul lost the battle. And I'll say, Paul won the war, because Paul didn't get paid one time, he got paid 20 times his original investment.
你可能会说，保罗在这场对抗中失败了。但我却认为，保罗赢了这场战争，因为保罗拿到的不是同倍的赔偿，他拿到了他最初投资额20倍的赔偿。

07:20
Then you have Barry Rosenstein. His fund, Jana Partners, started stealth-mode buying up stock in Whole Foods, at a time when Whole Foods was struggling. They got to eight percent, came out, and pushed Whole Foods to sell itself to Amazon, and not because Barry wanted same-day delivery of his organic Doritos.
接着我们再看看巴里 · 罗森斯坦的事迹。他的基金， Jana Partners，开始在全食超市（Whole Foods）陷入困境时，悄悄地购买它的股票。当他的持股占比达到8%时，他站出来推动全食超市把公司卖给亚马逊。并不是因为巴里想要他喜欢的有机玉米片能当天发货。

07:38
He wanted to make some money. Now, the CEO of Whole Foods, John Mackey, and the board did not want to sell themselves to Amazon, because that would be the prime example of selling out. But in the end, they caved. Why? Because Barry turned up the heat, and he made 300 million dollars in the process. And he did not leave a very nice impression on John. You're not going to see John and Barry just hugging it out at the Whole Foods café.
他是想要赚钱。不过全食超市的CEO 约翰 · 麦基和董事会不想把自己的公司卖给亚马逊，因为这将是企业出售的典型案例。但是最终，他们屈服了。为什么？因为巴里不断施压，并且在这个过程中赚了3亿美刀。他也并没有给约翰留下一个好印象。你不会在全食超市的咖啡店看到约翰和巴里拥抱。

08:08
Let's take a very different example now: the Chicago Teachers' Pension Fund, a $10 billion conscious investor. They recently came out hard against private prisons in the US, and good for them. As a new parent, I tell you, I am troubled by devastating images of young children being ripped out of the arms of their parents at the US border and being placed in private detention facilities that did too little to help the kids maintain contact with their parents.
让我们再看另外一个截然不同的例子：芝加哥的教师养老基金，一个价值100亿美金的责任意识投资。他们最近对美国的私人监狱进行了严厉的打击，并且对他们是有利的。作为一个父亲，我告诉诸位，我很讨厌那些发生在美国边境的把年轻孩子从父母怀抱扯走的虐心照片，或者那些年轻孩子被放在私人拘留中心的照片，这些拘留中心在帮助孩子和父母保持联系方面几乎毫无作为。

08:37
So what did the Chicago teachers do? Did they get management to make changes? Did they turn up the heat? Did they look management in the eye and say, "This is no way to run a business. There's a different way to do things. Let me show you"? No. They just sold their stock. Selling did nothing. It's not like management woke up the next day and had an epiphany and said, "Gosh, the teachers sold their stock. We'd better be nice to the kids." No. That didn't happen. And despite a decade of several high-profile divestitures in private prison stock in the US, the stock has continued to climb. The stock over that same period has outperformed the market. And the biggest issue is, we went from a set of conscious investors owning the stock to it potentially being owned by investors who don't care about these issues and don't care what you think about these issues.
那么芝加哥的教师们做了什么？他们设法让管理层做出改变了吗？他们施压了么？他们有看着管理层的眼睛说 “这不是做事情的方法。存在另外一种做事的方式，让我展示给你看"这些话吗？没有，他们只是在卖他们的股票。售卖做不了任何事情。管理层并不可能第二天起床后忽然顿悟并且说， “天呐，教师们卖了股票，我们还是对孩子好些吧。” 不，这并没有发生。尽管过去十年美国的私人监狱股票发生了几次受人瞩目的资产剥离，他们的股票依然在爬升。这些公司的股票在同一时期的表现超过了市场。并且最大的问题是，我们从一开始一帮有责任意识的投资者拥有这些股票，走到这些股票很有可能被那些不在乎这些问题，不在乎人们对这些问题看法的投资者所拥有的地步。

09:32
And this is my issue with conscious investors. Their MO is to divest or divert money into ESG-focused funds. You can't divest your way to a greener world. You can divest your way to a greener portfolio, not to a greener world.
这是我对有责任意识的投资者抱有的问题。他们的目标是撤资或者把资金转入 ESG关注的基金中。你不能按照自己的方式把资金转入一个更绿化的世界。你不能按照自己的方式把资金转入一个更绿化的投资中去，也不能到一个更绿化的世界中。

09:50
So what's it going to take? What's it going to take to flip the script, to get conscious investors to go from divesting to engaging, to go from talking about engaging to actually working with management to make changes that will improve their ESG performance? Because there's a lot suggesting they should and they could. They should, given the clear correlation between ESG performance and financial performance. They could because the activists have shown us they could.
那么要怎么办呢？怎么才能反转剧本，来让有责任意识的投资者从撤资转向参与，从仅仅讨论如何参与，到加入实际的管理工作中来，以便能制造改变，从而提高他们的ESG表现？因为有一堆他们应该并且可以采纳的建议，因为ESG表现和财务表现之间有明显的相关性。他们应该可以做到，因为他们已经证明了他们可以的。

A shareholder can drive change in a company. The difference is, Paul and Barry do what they do to make money. The conscious investors would do it to improve society and the environment and make money in the process and do it a little more collaboratively and constructively. And they have the backing of the some of the largest investors. Vanguard and BlackRock -- together, they manage trillions. They've been increasingly vocal about the importance of ESG. The CEO of BlackRock has been increasingly vocal in his annual letters about this issue. Even Jana Partners, the same OGs that John called "greedy bastards," recently co-wrote an open letter to the board of Apple, saying, "Hey, your smartphones are addictive for children. Fix it." Apple is working on it.
一个持股人可以驱动一个企业发生改变。不同之处在于，保罗和巴里做这些事情是为了赚钱。有责任意识的投资者做这些事情则是为了改良社会和环境，顺便从中获利，并且会以一种更具有合作性和建设性的方式来做事。他们还有一些大的投资者支持着。先锋集团和黑石集团，他们一起管理着百亿的资产。他们对ESG的重要性越来越直言不讳。黑石集团的CEO在他的年度来信中越来越直接的谈论这一问题。甚至连 Jana Partners，也就是被约翰称之为 “贪婪匪徒” 的老家伙们，近期也联合起来给苹果董事会写了一封公开信，信中说到：“嗨，你们的手机容易让小孩子上瘾。解决这个问题。” 苹果公司现在已经在解决这个问题了。

11:07
So what it's going to take is some pressure. It's going to take some pressure on conscious investors to, in turn, put some pressure on management to make changes that will improve the environment and society.
所以需要做的就是施加一点点压力。就是给有责任意识的投资者们一点压力，以顺便给管理层施压，使得他们能够做出改变来改进环境和社会。

And where do they start? They start by picking an issue that matters to them and taking a stand on it. Take a stand on an issue that lines up with your purpose: water preservation, labor rights, diversity. As long as it lines up with your purpose, you are golden.
那么他们要从哪里开始呢？他们从重视一个会影响自己的问题开始，并且坚持自己的立场。在一个问题上坚持自己的立场，该立场与你的目的一致：节约用水，劳动权利，多样性。一旦它与你的目的战线一致，你就成功了。

And the biggest unlock? Get the senior-most investment professionals focused on this. Today, when an activist shows up to a campaign, it's the senior investment professional talking to the CEO and the board and everyone hears about it. When a conscious investor shows up to talk about an ESG issue, it's some junior person in the risk department talking to some junior person in the investor relations department, and nobody hears about it, and that needs to change. And it's not some massive leap.
最大的发现是什么呢？让最资深的投资专家专注于此。今天，当一个激进投资者参与一个活动时，是他们的高级投资专家与 CEO和董事会进行对话，每一个人对此都有所耳闻。当一个有责任意识的投资者出面谈论ESG问题的时候，却是风险部门的低级职员去和投资关系部门的资历较浅的职员对话，并且大家对此一无所知，这种情况应该被改变。这不是什么巨大的飞跃。

Today, when a company underperforms financially, who is on the hook? The senior investment professional. So what do they do? They drop everything and work with management, collaboratively and constructively, to make changes to improve the company's financial performance. The same should be true when the company underperforms on ESG issues. And yes, that requires standardization on how we measure ESG, but we're on it.
今天当一个公司财务表现不佳时，谁是受害者？资深的投资专业人士。所以他们会做什么？他们会放下所有事情去参与管理，带有合作性和建设性的去参与，以期做出改变来提高公司的财务表现。当公司在 ESG问题上表现欠佳时，情况也应如此。是的，这就要求我们以标准化的方式来衡量ESG问题。但是我们已经在努力了。

12:29
So folks, here's my call to action: it's your money. It's your pension fund, it's your sovereign wealth fund. it's your university's endowment. It's your money. And it's your right to have your money managed in line with your values. So use your voice and trust that it matters. It was your voice that got the investors more conscious in the first place. You protested for years, because you didn't feel right about your money being invested in companies whose values don't line up with yours. It's time to use that voice again. But this time, instead of pushing them to divest, push them to engage, truly engage, truly work with management to make changes that will improve their ESG performance.
所以各位，我想发出这样的呼吁：这是你的钱。这是你的养老基金。这是你至高无上的财富基金。这是你们对大学的捐款。这是你的钱。你有权让你的钱财以一种和你价值观相符的方式被管理起来。所以，使用你的呼声，并且相信这很重要。是你的呼声第一时间让投资者更有觉悟。你抗议了很多年，因为你感觉到不对劲，对于你的钱财被投资在那些和你价值观不符的公司，是时候再次使用该呼声了。但是，这次不是推动他们撤资，而是推动他们参与其中，真正的参与，真正的从事管理工作，以便做出改变来提高ESG的表现。

13:12
You made them aware of the issues. You can now focus them on fixing them.
是你让他们意识到了这些问题。你现在也可聚焦于让他们解决这些问题。